Call Us: 423 661-4734 | Email: requests@comeandreason.com      
Open Theism

Open Theism

Is it not true that [you have a link in Come And Reason’s Web Resources to] Greg Boyd is a leading open theist?  He advocates a view that God’s omniscience is seeing all possibilities, not the choices that have not yet been made by human free will.

  I agree with Greg Boyd in this area.

Well, in lesson number 4, you suggest that God did foresee absolutely the fall of man, while the author suggests it was just a possibility.  Then you go on to state how horrible a God would be if he did not foresee it.  As an open theist I am wanting your thoughts on the matter?

Pastor M


Thank you for contacting me. You are right that Come And Reason has a link to Greg Boyd’s website and I believe you are right that he is an open theist. I have never met Greg Boyd nor read about his views on this subject, but have heard others tell me this is true.

However, I have also heard that Greg Boyd has a sincerely open mind and is honestly pursuing truth, wanting to follow it where it leads, therefore I anticipate in time he will change his view on this issue. If you are wondering why their is a link to his site it is because I agree with him on God’s methods of rulership, namely the law of love rather than the rule of force. I have read some beautiful things he has written on this subject and believe he is right on.

Regarding open theism: I have to follow the evidence and truth where it leads. There are two types of evidence in the Bible, declarative  statements and the historical record. Let’s look at the historical record first, which I find more persuasive.

At the time of the flood God directed Noah to build how many arks? Why only one? If God didn’t know beforehand how people would respond, if God could only calculate the various possibilities and until the door to the ark was closed God was still wondering how many would respond, then what does it mean that God didn’t have more arks ready? If God didn’t know beforehand how many would say yes and choose to get onboard, wouldn’t that mean He never intended to let all on, but just a few people, thus making Noah’s 120 years of preaching a sham? I reject this view and believe that God did know their choices before they made them and Noah preached to show God did not exclude anyone, thus only one ark was needed, because God foreknew how they would choose.

The prophecies of Daniel demonstrating the fall of kingdoms one after the other and predicting the rise of the next kingdom all the way through the fall of Rome to the second coming demonstrate that God foreknew choices and events, not just the possibilities that might occur. I realize open theists are not comfortable with this so they try and move the date of Daniel to the time of the Roman Empire and yet what does the prophecy next predict? That there would be no other world empire to rise.  This prediction goes completely against the trend of history as four empires in a row had come and human thought would have predicted another to follow. Only One who knows the future before it happens could have predicted with such certainty that no other world power would control those lands again. This requires knowledge of individual decisions of how kings and generals will act.

Now the declarative statements:

(Isa 46:9,10) “I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is none like me, declaring the end from the beginning and from ancient times things not yet done., saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:

Ecc 3:11 He hath made every [thing] beautiful in his time: also he hath set the world in their heart, so that no man can find out the work that God maketh from the beginning to the end.

Finally, I do not believe God is restricted by the physical laws of the universe such as gravity, thermodynamics, etc. To me this also means God is not restricted by the fabric of space/time. In other words, God lives outside of time. We are linear creatures who live in time, but God is not.

God sits above, over, and outside of time and can see clearly all history; past, present, and future.  To Him there is no mystery and no uncertainty. Our infinite God can enter and exit time as He pleases. There are places in history where God has entered into time to experience and share it with His creatures. He entered time daily to visit with Adam and Eve in the cool of the day before their fall. He visited Abraham and Moses and spoke with them as friends. Ultimately, He came and lived for 33 years as one of us within the confines of time.

Understanding this gives us insight into how God can say things like He was grieved that He had made mankind (Gen 6:6). God stepped into time and expressed in terms we humans could understand the pain in His heart over wayward man. But this does not mean God is restricted by time. He can enter or leave time easier than we can enter or leave a pool of water.

The open theism view restricts God.  It places Him under the confines of linear existence and reduces Him from infinite to something less than infinite, a being confined by the limitations of space/time which He created. This I cannot accept. My God is infinite in love, in goodness, in power, in knowledge, and in ability.

Email me the blog whenever a new one is published.

Donate online, securely via PayPal using your credit or debit card (no PayPal account needed, unless you want to set up a monthly, recurring payment).


cancel recurring payment

 

Want to use zelle instead?
See how on our
Support and Donations page.

Upcoming Events

calendar

Testimonial Post Slider

Testimony 66

I am incredibly grateful for the transformative impact you’ve had on my life, and words cannot fully express my appreciation. Over the years, I have been an avid listener and follower of C&R and extend my heartfelt thanks for creating the C&R mobile app. It has allowed me to immerse myself in your lessons repeatedly, enabling me to grasp the profound significance about the Character of God, Design Law, the protocols for life, the reasons behind the current chaos, and Christ’s mission to restore everything. They have deeply touched me. Having studied with various churches, I came away with the perception that God is no different from the deities of ancient Greek or Roman mythology—demanding sacrifices and taking pleasure in bloodshed. Thanks to your transformative teachings, I have experienced a profound awakening to the true nature of God and the immense power of His love. It is truly a remarkable and liberating sensation to finally grasp the truth and embrace the empowering nature of God’s laws. My self-perception has become brighter and more infused with love. My journey of growth continues on a daily basis.

Chris P., Lake Mary, FL, USA

 

Testimony 52

Your unique way in spreading the truth is what we all need today. Most of us don’t recognize the contamination coming from all the lies and selfishness in the world. Because of our fear of death, we forgot how to live. Lies left and right. I was losing hope and faith, because of so many ideas that are always contradicting each other – so many questions answered by other, more complicated, questions – until I found your channel on YouTube.

You did not just give me answers, you also taught me how to answer new questions that arise in my mind. Now I see things differently. I see God’s mercy, grace, and Love everywhere, in spite of all the chaos that we all have done as humans. I don’t fear death anymore. Accepting the Truth and Love about God is truly a genuine Freedom from all the confusions, sufferings, selfishness, pain, and death.

I just wanted to say, thank you, sooooo much for revealing the real Remedy for our infected life. I have a new hope and now see the world in a different perspective!

Wheinny P., University Place, WA, USA

 

Testimony 41

I have been blessed by your ministry. I have experienced personally, and deeply resonate with, the God of love and the beautiful picture of God’s character that you present. I have seen your seminar series on YouTube, read ‘The Journal of the Watcher’ book, used your mobile app, and also listen/study the bible study lesson with you each week. I concur with many of the thoughts and perspectives that you share. I understand your conclusions on natural laws vs imposed law and the legal/penal substitution (incorrect diagnosis). This makes perfect sense to me.

Bless you for all you do.

Melissa L.

 

Testimony 21

I am absolutly on fire with the message at Come and Reason! I can’t get enough! I’ve read your book, blog, and articles. I’ve listened to your Bible study podcasts, your radio show, and your series – all excellent! It wasn’t until the past couple of years that I have I like I’m becoming “healthy,” with more to share with others than just beasts and commandments! I used to be a Bible worker and preached when the pastors were gone until I had had enough. I didnt realize at the time what the problem was, but i know now… the message wasn’t properly focused. Now my flame is rekindled. All of your little examples are so perfect in explaining something “complicated” and making it easily understood! Now I’m trying to shape it into a life changing evangelistic series! Thank you!

M.T., USA

 

Testimony 27

Your teachings about our heavenly Father have changed my life. Thank you sooooooo very very much! I know He’s doing some serious healing in my heart and life and I look forward to each new day to learn something new about Him and to just hear you speak about Him. Thank you, forever.

Nancy S.

 

Testimony 50

After coming into contact with Come And Reason Ministries, I can finally say that many of my unanswered questions have fallen into place. I discovered that my view of God’s Law was “imposed laws and rules” with “imposed punishments” and that this was the major culprit of my many unanswered questions. Thanks be to God for using you and those around you to help us who have struggled with this “infection” of thought. I have now rejected the “imposed law” concept to fully embrace “Design Law”… to look thru “Design Law,” instead of “imposed law,” is a relief.

Viliami L., Australia

 

Testimony 63

I’ve been very blessed by “The God Shaped Brain” and this ministry, through video and podcast, over the last few years. It’s truly opened up my eyes more to the truth about God and the importance of that truth in the present world. The message is so inviting, freeing and enlightening and MORE people need to know about it. I believe it is the last message that can truly, not only prepare a people for salvation and translation, but vindicate the character of God.

Michael V., Yonkers, NY, USA

 

Testimony 3

My husband is a pastor and I listen to your lesson almost every week. Thank you for helping me in my study life and to help me love the “real” God more.

C. F., NC, USA

 

Testimony 4

I’m a youth leader in South Africa. We as a youth group are currently using a lot of the material on the Come and Reason site. Since we’ve started using the material, our youth group has grown.

R. V. N., South Africa

 

Testimony 73

I have been truly blessed by your blogs and other resources. They have helped me to see things in a much brighter light and to reason things out better. Thank you so much for your ministry. Whenever I have the opportunity I pass along your material to my friends.

R. Noseworthy, Newfoundland, Canada

Testimony 53

I was so blessed by a friend who gave me your book, “The God Shaped Brain,” while I was sitting in church asking God to please help me learn more about Him and help me not to be so confused and scared. That was about 2 years ago. Your books have helped me to love God even more. I’m not confused or scared anymore! I have listened to all of your bible study classes and feel like I know the wonderful people that attend every week. Thank you for all that you’re doing in spreading the true message about God and His law of love. God bless you and your whole class.

Elssy P., Modesto, CA, USA

 

Testimony 65

I have been tuning into your weekly study classes for a while now and wanted express my appreciation for the teachings that ha been a huge blessing in opening up the true message of the word. Viewing scripture under an imposed law theory always, without fail, raised more questions, concerns, and conflicting scripture interpretations that were discouraging at the very least. Looking at scripture through the design law lens has brought more truth to light for me personally and an understanding of our Heavenly Father that places Him “above all others,” where I am now more than thrilled to witness and serve Him.  I “stumbled” across this ministry a year or so ago and would only watch a few minutes at a time. But the more I listened and the longer I paid attention, the more my spiritual eyes were opened to the ever present truths of scripture. The comprehension of the great controversy and it’s origin by the lies perpetrated and perpetuated throughout the Bible on the attack of God’s character and government is truly priceless. Keep up the Good Work! Your servanthood is desperately needed in such a time as this!

Jeff D., Reading, MA, USA

 

Testimony 68

Your message of design law vs imperial law is so uplifting and makes so much sense- it is a game changer for me. The fact that Jesus’s death is not a big payment by an angry God is , quite frankly, a relief.

Laura G., London, Ontario, Canada

 

Testimony 17

The blessings of clarity and understanding you and your class inspire me to take from the word of God have impressed upon me so greatly the true, loving character of our Creator. I have found amazing freedom and joy through building a stronger, more intentional relationship with Him. What is new is that this is now a relationship built on love, reverence and respect rather than fear and obligation, and as such my eyes have been slammed OPEN as I am continually impressed by the manifestations of God’s true character in His provisions for fallen man.

T.E.H., Salt Lake City, UT, USA

 

Testimony 75

Thank you so much for everything you do! Because of all these truths, I’m excited to be with Jesus! I always pray everyday, “COME TODAY, JESUS.” Before finding C&R, I was always praying for delays, “NOT TODAY OH GOD. I AM NOT READY.” I just need to share more, talk more bout this truth, so everybody will be excited for Jesus.

J C Shin