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Trinity – More Questions

Trinity – More Questions

I just read your blog on the Trinity and thought everything you said was absolutely true. However, I have often wondered two things:

Number 1 is, if Jesus was not created then why is He subservient to the Father? As far as I understand it The Father is in charge, under him is Jesus and beneath Jesus is the Holy Spirit. Ellen White says that Jesus was uplifted to equality with the Father which was part of what inspired Lucifer’s rebellion. Why would God the Father have to bestow honor upon God the Son to make Him His equal if they are both from eternity past God?

Number 2 is, Why does the Godhead (which is defined by love) have to operate under the same structure of authority as a corporate business or military branch?

M


Thanks for your questions as your question may reflect the way many think about the Godhead. But, I think the idea that Jesus is “subservient” to the Father is a misunderstanding that results from not appreciating God’s character and the way His government works. In God’s economy “whoever wants to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for me and for the gospel will save it” (Mark 8:35), “So the last will be first, and the first will be last.” (Matt 20:16).

God’s kingdom is the kingdom of love and love gives all for the wellbeing of others. Thus Jesus is “exalted” because Jesus surrendered all and gave all for others. This exaltation is not “conferred” by the Father to the Son, but a result of the accomplishment of the Son in perfectly revealing and carrying out the Father’s character and purpose.

A better way to understand it, (recognizing of course that our finite minds are trying to probe the Infinite One so we will inevitably come up short of complete understanding), is that the Godhead voluntarily assumed different roles or functions for the accomplishments of Their purposes (a loving way all share together in giving for Their creation). Any of the three could have assumed any of the functions. We would err in concluding that when one of the three assumes a function that He was not capable of functioning in the role of one of the others.

As I understand their chosen roles, the Father acts as the source of all that is good. The Son is the medium, mediator, advocate, conduit, agent through which the Father reveals Himself or acts and the Holy Spirit is the actualizer or applier of what the Father and Son have achieved. Thus God was in the Son reconciling the world to Himself (2Cor 5:19). Jesus’ work on earth was the acting out of the Father’s heart. His completed mission and victory over sin are applied to the lives of believers by the work of the Holy Spirit. In creation we have the Father as the source, the Son as the architect, designer, and builder and the Spirit as the actualizer or implementer of Their design.

So, with this understanding we realize what Christ meant when He said, “I do nothing of myself.” Christ takes from the Father to fulfill all the Father’s purposes for His universe. In this sense we can see Christ turning to the Father, not to persuade the Father to be kind, but to receive the fullness of the Father’s purpose of love for His creation and carry that purpose out in meaningful action!

Regarding the comments from Ellen White, these are her exact words:

“The King of the universe summoned the heavenly hosts before Him, that in their presence He might set forth the true position of His Son and show the relation He sustained to all created beings. The Son of God shared the Father’s throne, and the glory of the eternal, self-existent One encircled both…. Leaving his place in the immediate presence of the Father, Lucifer went forth to diffuse the spirit of discontent among the angels….The exaltation of the Son of God as equal with the Father was represented as an injustice to Lucifer, who, it was claimed, was also entitled to reverence and honor. …There had been no change in the position or authority of Christ. Lucifer’s envy and misrepresentation and his claims to equality with Christ had made necessary a statement of the true position of the Son of God; but this had been the same from the beginning. Many of the angels were, however, blinded by Lucifer’s deceptions.” PP 37, 38

Finally, the Godhead does not operate like a human corporation or military. Jesus said, “My kingdom is not of this world.” God’s kingdom of love is not represented by human nations or corporations which are constantly seeking to promote themselves at the expense of others. God sacrifices Himself for others!

Christ Jesus, who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be grasped, but made himself nothing, taking the very nature of a servant, being made in human likeness. And being found in appearance as a man, he humbled himself and became obedient to death— even death on a cross! Therefore God exalted him to the highest place and gave him the name that is above every name…Philippians 2:6-9

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Testimony 71

When I was 9 years old, I remember setting at our devotional table with a hunger and thirst for God that wanted more, deeper, BETTER. I can remember literally crying and pounding on the table, “I know these teachers didn’t mean to give us error. They taught what THEY had been TAUGHT, but didn’t ANYBODY READ THE BOOK?!?!?” It mattered to me then. It mattered to me as a teenager. It matters now as I teach bible classes. It didn’t have to be so hard as I watched so many give up and lay God’s great plan and gift of salvation aside as being “impossible.” Then, a friend sent me a link to Come And Reason’s website. I grew excited. YES! FINALLY! Then another friend told me to stay away, saying her son had just broken up with a girl because she was involved with Come And Reason and that “Tim Jennings preaches a false gospel.” But, AFTER many years of developing an authentic and, dare I say FUN relationship with Jesus, through the Holy Spirit I see this message has been around a LONG time, since the apostle Paul, Ellen White, Graham Maxwell, Ray Foucher, and yourself (though I admit, you’ve made me back up, rewind and replay the clips, and get out my well-worn Bible on a few things.) I’m so thankful I have found LIGHT during these DARK days. I am not alone.

Vicki DiNitto

Testimony 37

Hearing Dr. Jennings’ presentations in person came at a pivotal moment in my spiritual journey that began about nine months ago, when the fault lines inherent in my belief system began to crack under questions that most reasonable people end up asking about God and His nature. These were questions I couldn’t find answers to, and they shook my faith. I was unable let it go any longer and be satisfied. My Christian experience became distant. I was afraid; the fear in me rose like thorns, pushing me away from Jesus. And then someone heard my questions and introduced me to this ministry, and my life has totally changed.

I can tell you that this new, “present truth” message is far grander and life-changing than when I shifted from being an agnostic and then a nominal Christian. It has radically altered my worldview, because it reveals a God that makes sense. It is a revolution. I believe that Dr. Jennings’ message is the final message that must go to the world. If any message could be called “righteousness by faith,” as abused as that term is by the right and the left, this is that message, because Jennings’ biblical message identifies a God who is different, whose character isn’t an impossible contradiction.

I walk this path now without fear. I see people differently, and the Holy Spirit burns in my heart. Many call Dr. Jennings’ message false and compromising, but it isn’t false, because I’ve seen the fruits within my mind and body. It is not compromising, because in this message is the only road to holiness that makes any sense. No longer do I behold a pagan god who is always angry and suspicious. Instead, I behold a God who is freeing and loving, always working for our good, and giving me every reason to love my enemy even to my own death, just as Jesus pleads with us. God is good.

Anthony L., CA, USA

 

Testimony 64

I’ve been reading the bible and walking with Jesus since I was around 16. I’m 42 now. I’ve mostly been alone in my walk although I went to several churches in different denominations. For the past 3 years God has been showing me His character of agape. It’s been a blessing and changed how I view God and my walk with Jesus. About a year ago I came across the power of love and the principles of design law. These teachings changed how I read scripture and have been such a beautiful blessing. I’m very excited and grateful for these truths. We share these truths of agape, design law and the reality of the principles of the two trees in the garden of Eden with people on Facebook and YouTube. People all over are learning to trust God and His agape design law which makes life possible. Thank you for everything you shared with me. May God continue to bless your ministry and lives.

Bradley M., Hinsdale, NY, USA

 

Testimony 1

Thank you! I love listening to the Come And Reason Ministries Bible study classes and am using some of your notes to get the lessons together that I will be teaching. You always have such good quotes and Bible texts and pull things together to make good sense.

T. C., IN, USA

 

Testimony 15

I have been sharing Come And Reason Ministries Bible study lessons with several folk. You have such a beautiful view of the plan of salvation. If we had this message preached when I was young, my generation would still all be in church.

H. R., New Zealand

Testimony 59

I’m a native Ghanan, but am currently in France for my master’s degree. Prior to this, during my final years at undergraduate studies in Ghana, I was introduced to your ministry and I’ve been immensely blessed by what you share, especially about the Design and Imposed Laws. God richly bless you for that.

One of the first things I did when I arrived in France was to buy all four of your books. They not only helped me, but those I shared them with. I shared the message with an atheist student and I marveled at how God worked mightily in his life. Today this person shares the Love of God with others and debunks theories of who God is not. I want to share what you present in your “Heavenly Sanctuary and Investigative Judgment” pamphlet, because the message brought rest to my soul and I live today as a healthy person.

God bless you so much and your ministry.

Michael A., Ghana

 

Testimony 39

[This ministry is the] biggest blessing I have ever received! Your DVDs and lessons could not have come at a better time in my life. I have experienced in the past year many difficulties that, if it wasn’t for this wonderful view of God that I have discovered through this ministry, I would not have been able to respond in love and forgiveness. My heart is being transformed everyday by the Calvary-looking God you teach. Hallelujah!! I have tears in my eyes as I write, because my life has taken a complete turn from where I was heading.

I am from Central America. Most of my family is scattered in different parts of the world and all have the same view of God that I had growing up; a distant, exacting, and ready-to-punish-us-with-tragedy type of God. So, I have been translating lessons for my family and, to my surprise, they have also been sharing them with others! I can already see the difference. My brother has often said, “Thank you for sharing, I have never heard it this way!” My other family members are taking an amazing turn from a message of “repent or burn” towards a loving God, pleading to us that we won’t reject him because he loves us eternally.

Bless you for all you do.

Sofia S., Ashfield, MA, USA

 

Testimony 23

I would just like to add my voice to the many people who, I believe, must have contacted you to express their appreciation for the “Healing the Mind” DVDs. I’ve been listening to your Bible study class discussions for many years and I’ve been personally blessed by your research and teaching about the character of God.

L. G., Oakland, MI, USA

 

Testimony 4

I’m a youth leader in South Africa. We as a youth group are currently using a lot of the material on the Come and Reason site. Since we’ve started using the material, our youth group has grown.

R. V. N., South Africa

 

Testimony 45

I have been confused for years about what [christianity] calls [its] most disgusting teaching. It has never made much sense to me and for that reason has been evermore empty. I have listened to your class off and on and have struggled determining what is truth, because of the resistance design law encounters in the church. So, I thank God for your ministry. What you teach makes sense. It’s logical and backed up by the power of love. I have never seen that in Christ until now. I am astounded by the insight that is found when we look at God’s ministry through design law. All strength to this message, as I believe it to be the power of God.

Brendon S.

 

Testimony 51

I Love This Ministry!!!!!!! I see first hand how this message is desperately needed, how erroneous beliefs about God and His Character negatively affect humanity at every level. I thank God for your ministry, as I was searching on my own and was discovering some of your same beliefs and was blown away when I found your ministry. I know you hear it all the time, but it is truly life changing. May God continue to reveal His Will to you and Bless you!

Eric S., Sanford, FL, USA

 

Testimony 12

I have been really blessed reading your response to the various questions on your site.

K.C., OH, USA

 

Testimony 24

I wanted to thank you very much for presenting your understanding of God. I’ve always been troubled by this question: Why did Jesus have to die? Since my conversion I understood that The Father & Jesus are one, I did not have issues with that. But was there not any other way to save us than for Jesus to die? I guess I actually had a question about God – if He is so wise, how come He did not find another way? I did not see the real ‘beauty’  in the cross. Only when you explained the picture in the medical context, Jesus providing medicine for my selfishness, have I started to finally ‘see the light’. Thank you so much. Your seminar, “Healing the Mind,” are absolutely marvelous & have shared them with my family and many other people, including colleagues at work. Thanks, thanks, thanks. May God bless you abundantly in your ministry.

M. W., Australia

 

Testimony 70

I have been watching you for many years and have learned to love God with all my heart. I was raised by a loving Christian mother that had been lied to about who God really was, so our religious upbringing was hell fire and damnation. As soon as I was old enough and moved out, I not only left the church, I ran as fast as I could to get away from it. Sad to say, it wasn’t until the past couple of years that I learned and understand who my Father really is and how much He loves me. I understand God’s Design Laws (which make sense) and when I’m teaching my church Bible study class, I’m able to really put to use the things I’ve been learning and Holy Spirit is leading. Thank you for introducing me to my Father of true, pure love. Everyday with Him is new and exciting. One thing that breaks my heart is that I didn’t know Him sooner. God Bless you and your ministry!

Judy Phelps, Reno, NV, USA

Testimony 65

I have been tuning into your weekly study classes for a while now and wanted express my appreciation for the teachings that ha been a huge blessing in opening up the true message of the word. Viewing scripture under an imposed law theory always, without fail, raised more questions, concerns, and conflicting scripture interpretations that were discouraging at the very least. Looking at scripture through the design law lens has brought more truth to light for me personally and an understanding of our Heavenly Father that places Him “above all others,” where I am now more than thrilled to witness and serve Him.  I “stumbled” across this ministry a year or so ago and would only watch a few minutes at a time. But the more I listened and the longer I paid attention, the more my spiritual eyes were opened to the ever present truths of scripture. The comprehension of the great controversy and it’s origin by the lies perpetrated and perpetuated throughout the Bible on the attack of God’s character and government is truly priceless. Keep up the Good Work! Your servanthood is desperately needed in such a time as this!

Jeff D., Reading, MA, USA