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Response to Quotes in the Book, Confrontation

Response to Quotes in the Book, Confrontation

I read the book called “Confrontation.” How do you understand the following statement: “The Majesty of heaven, through love and pity for fallen man, proposed to become his substitute and surety. He would bear man’s guilt. He would take the wrath of His Father upon Himself, which otherwise would have fallen upon man because of his disobedience.

The law of God was unalterable. It could not be abolished, nor yield the smallest part of its claim, to meet man in his fallen state.” Confrontation p. 16

E.

A second person wrote:

I am wondering if you have more information and maybe an explanation on the Study Guide quote on page 70 [for] Friday, November 21, 2008.  “Christ’s work was to reconcile man to God through His human nature, and God to man through His divine nature”  Confrontation. p. 38

I have a problem with the last part of the sentence. 

H.


To E let me say, please reread my post from last week entitled Christ Our Substitute.

Christ did become mankind’s substitute when He took upon Himself the responsibility to, in His humanity, complete the mission Adam was created to fulfill – reveal the truth about God, and when He reversed all the damage that sin had caused humanity. He overcame the infection of fear and selfishness (sin) and restored God’s love perfectly into humanity. He is now the source of salvation to all who obey Him (Heb 5:8).  Bearing man’s guilt is the same as taking our condition, our situation, our position, our infirmity, our terminal condition, our sick state (Isa 53:4).  Christ took our place for the purpose of curing our condition.

The wrath of God is described throughout the Bible. In Romans 1:18 Paul says “The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of men who suppress the truth by their wickedness.” The Greek in this text is active present-tense, as in today, in Paul’s day, not one day in the future at the end of time. The wrath of God was happening in Paul’s day and Paul tells us in verses 24, 26, and 28 what God’s wrath actually is. He states, because of their persistent rejection of truth, because of their refusal to open their hearts, God “let’s them go” and “gives them up” to reap what they have chosen. God’s wrath is the act of giving up on them, stopping His passionate pursuit for their salvation. It is Love relinquishing His lover to her self-destructive choice (for more Bible examples of God’s wrath see my blog, The Question of Punishment Part 2).

When we understand wrath correctly, then we can see that the wrath of the Father fell on His Son when the Father “gave up” Christ at the Cross. “My God, My God, why have you forsaken me.” This letting go, this giving up to reap what one has ultimately chosen, is God’s wrath. Paul confirms this in Romans 4:25 when he uses the exact same Greek word to describe God’s action toward Christ as he did in chapter 1:24,26,28 to describe God’s action toward the unrepentant. Christ was “let go” by God to experience what Christ had chosen, to be our Savior, to overcome selfishness with love, to go through the Cross! And because of Christ, our condition now has a remedy. We can be cured and therefore God will not “let go” anyone who accepts Christ’s victory in their life!

The reason God’s law could not be altered is because the law of love is the template, the base code, the operating system, the life principle that all life is designed, created, and built to operate upon. There is no other way for life to exist in God’s universe. To change the law would be to kill everything in the universe, thus the law cannot change. Humanity’s operating system, our character, and our methods, motives, and principles must be brought back into harmony with the law of love. This is what Christ did for us!


To H, thanks for your question.

Regarding reconciliation, Christ came to restore mankind back into God’s original ideal and thus reunite mankind with God. This is what I believe the author meant in the first part of the quote where Christ reconciled man to God in His human nature.

I understand the last part of the quote to mean that in Christ, God’s divine nature was united with humanity, thus bringing God to man, because man could not get to God. Remember the old song, “He came down to my level because I couldn’t get up to His”? I believe the author in this passage is referring to Christ bringing God’s very nature to humanity, because we couldn’t, in our fallen state, reach or unify ourselves to God.

Any idea or teaching that Christ was “working on the Father” to influence Him, to assuage the wrath of the Father, and to get the Father to be forgiving etc. is not supported by the Bible. Thus, the author, if understood to be in harmony with the Bible, cannot be suggesting any type of appeasement, expiation, or action Christ took in the past, present, or future that in any way changes God.

Bible evidence to support this would include:

  • Jesus will not pray (ask) His Father for us, because the Father Himself loves us.  John 16:26
  • God is for us, God justifies us, and if this isn’t good enough, don’t worry… Christ, in addition to the Father, is interceding for us.  Romans 8:31-34
  • Jesus is an exact representation of the Father.  Hebrews 1:3
  • God loved us so much They (all three) initiated the plan of salvation.  John 3:16

In summary, Jesus is the member of the Godhead through whom God could reach mankind with His saving love. Jesus was the means through whom God could reveal the truth about Himself in order to win us back to trust.  And further, Jesus was the means through whom God restored His law of love back into the human species, thus saving, healing, recreating, and redeeming this creation!
 

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Testimony 22

I have found your Bible study class lectures to be very inspiring and useful as I prepare to teach class every other week. I subscribe to the podcast and download your notes on the weeks I teach. The audio and notes are such a great help in preparing. My own understanding of God’s character has grown as I teach the class. Commendations on the thought-provoking and well-prepared material Come and Reason provides. Personally, I get excited by the tie you make between the spiritual and mental/physical domains.

A.A. Corrales, NM, USA

 

Testimony 5

We listen to your bible studies lessons in our class in Montana. You actually were the main reason I decided to get a laptop, so I can go to your site and listen, read, learn, and print the class notes. I am so grateful to learn the correct view of God and his character. Now, to just have others have an interest in knowing, so I can share it with them. Good thoughts your way.

R. N., MT, USA

 

Testimony 16

Your seminars are still inspiring and changing our lives and we continue to share the principles we have learned from you. Your ministry has changed our lives!

E.W.

 

Testimony 43

Two years ago I stumbled upon your book, “Could It Be This Simple,” and then found “The God-Shaped Brain” videos on YouTube, your bible study class, and the ‘Come And Reason’ mobile app. I shared your book with a friend and after nine months of showing love, patience, and kindness this person has been changed by the love of God, too. The same love that healed me, I now express to other women in tangible ways, such as to a Baptist woman with high anxiety and childhood trauma. She was extremely happy and relieved when I shared about the so-called “judgment of God” and burning in hell. She had no desire to serve a God that was so harsh. I have repeated the phrase dozens of times to her. “What we believe has power over us, but we have power over what we believe…”

This message that you are sharing has changed my life. I will continue to serve other women and bring this message of God’s healing love to their lives by sharing your books, YouTube videos, and The Remedy Bible app. Keep up the good work. Don’t be discouraged. God is doing a mighty work in and through this ministry!

Jill L., Midwest, USA

 

Testimony 21

I am absolutly on fire with the message at Come and Reason! I can’t get enough! I’ve read your book, blog, and articles. I’ve listened to your Bible study podcasts, your radio show, and your series – all excellent! It wasn’t until the past couple of years that I have I like I’m becoming “healthy,” with more to share with others than just beasts and commandments! I used to be a Bible worker and preached when the pastors were gone until I had had enough. I didnt realize at the time what the problem was, but i know now… the message wasn’t properly focused. Now my flame is rekindled. All of your little examples are so perfect in explaining something “complicated” and making it easily understood! Now I’m trying to shape it into a life changing evangelistic series! Thank you!

M.T., USA

 

Testimony 36

Thank you and may God continue to bless you as you share with others the intricacies of how we are all “fearfully and wonderfully made”. I must share that you have opened a whole new world to me, and I have found tremendous healing through what you have shared in two of your books, “Could It Be This Simple?” and “The God Shaped Brain.” I praise God for what you shared, what I have learned, and how I have grown and healed! My prayer is that My Precious Jesus will be seen by others in the way I live, act, talk, etc. and they may be encouraged to know He is truly a GREAT God of LOVE, desiring that no one should perish! God Bless you in your continued endeavors to present Him as He really is!

Joleen H. GA, USA

 

Testimony 73

I have been truly blessed by your blogs and other resources. They have helped me to see things in a much brighter light and to reason things out better. Thank you so much for your ministry. Whenever I have the opportunity I pass along your material to my friends.

R. Noseworthy, Newfoundland, Canada

Testimony 49

I came into the church at 21, but that is as far as it went. I was so confused about what love is. I couldn’t find it in the bible, because I am not a person that can read between the lines. I have no logic. I have read many, many books; trying to figure out the crux of the matter. They were helpful, but something was still missing. I have become very frustrated to the point of crying out to God, “Where can I go?”  I needed some basics.

I found two books, written by Timothy Jennings, MD, to be very helpful. God showed me that I had lived my whole life in fear. I didn’t even see it. Now, I do. God is so good.  I discovered the “The Remedy”  Dr. Jennings new book, “The God-Shaped Heart!” Oh, I was so excited, I purchased them right away.

I can get rid of most of my books, because “The Remedy” brings the Love of God out so clearly, even I can’t miss it. Now, I want to sit and read my Bible. Wow, what a revelation! It is just simply Awesome! I am so grateful to Jehovah Almighty for hearing my prayer for more understanding! I am so encouraged!

Jackie S.

 

Testimony 71

When I was 9 years old, I remember setting at our devotional table with a hunger and thirst for God that wanted more, deeper, BETTER. I can remember literally crying and pounding on the table, “I know these teachers didn’t mean to give us error. They taught what THEY had been TAUGHT, but didn’t ANYBODY READ THE BOOK?!?!?” It mattered to me then. It mattered to me as a teenager. It matters now as I teach bible classes. It didn’t have to be so hard as I watched so many give up and lay God’s great plan and gift of salvation aside as being “impossible.” Then, a friend sent me a link to Come And Reason’s website. I grew excited. YES! FINALLY! Then another friend told me to stay away, saying her son had just broken up with a girl because she was involved with Come And Reason and that “Tim Jennings preaches a false gospel.” But, AFTER many years of developing an authentic and, dare I say FUN relationship with Jesus, through the Holy Spirit I see this message has been around a LONG time, since the apostle Paul, Ellen White, Graham Maxwell, Ray Foucher, and yourself (though I admit, you’ve made me back up, rewind and replay the clips, and get out my well-worn Bible on a few things.) I’m so thankful I have found LIGHT during these DARK days. I am not alone.

Vicki DiNitto

Testimony 30

God lead me to your book “The God-Shaped Brain” while I was searching for another book about the brain and then to your interview about your book on HeartWise Ministries [where] I found out about [Come And Reason Ministries]. I’m now devouring the webcasts of your Bible studies. I have been so greatly blessed and I thank God so much for your courage to speak the Truth in love no matter what. Listening to you contrast the two opposing systems (laws) and digging deep to unearth the hidden treasures in the Bible makes me so incredibly happy and I feel very blessed to be part of your Bible Study Group although I live far away. I am just so excited that there is a group of people that is spreading the Truth about the character of God and it saddens me how few realize what our Father in Heaven is really like.

Kessy B., Australia

 

Testimony 65

I have been tuning into your weekly study classes for a while now and wanted express my appreciation for the teachings that ha been a huge blessing in opening up the true message of the word. Viewing scripture under an imposed law theory always, without fail, raised more questions, concerns, and conflicting scripture interpretations that were discouraging at the very least. Looking at scripture through the design law lens has brought more truth to light for me personally and an understanding of our Heavenly Father that places Him “above all others,” where I am now more than thrilled to witness and serve Him.  I “stumbled” across this ministry a year or so ago and would only watch a few minutes at a time. But the more I listened and the longer I paid attention, the more my spiritual eyes were opened to the ever present truths of scripture. The comprehension of the great controversy and it’s origin by the lies perpetrated and perpetuated throughout the Bible on the attack of God’s character and government is truly priceless. Keep up the Good Work! Your servanthood is desperately needed in such a time as this!

Jeff D., Reading, MA, USA

 

Testimony 67

I was introduced to Come And Reason by a friend of my mother-in-law, who gave me several CD’s of Dr. Jennings. The clarity of the message and recognition that God’s is a God of love was so clear, advancing beyond Dr. Maxwell’s message. However, grappled with Maxwell saying God used emergency measures for the fallen world. Now after several years of being a regular listener of the Come And Reasoning bible study class and attending Jennings’ meetings in Dallas/Fort Worth, TX, things are becoming clearer for me. Design law versus imposed law has added so much to my personal understanding of theology. This message has really impacted my work in counseling so many people miserable because they are searching for and trusting human governments to create order and peace or believing in a God who says love Me or I will kill you. I am grateful that I have an alternative view to offer my clients that makes sense. I teach a bible study class on a semi-regular basis and I value the materials that Come And Reason so freely offers to aid me in presenting this vital message. Thank you for continuing to provide advancement in our very limited understanding of a Infinite God that is rational and believable.

Dr. Roger D, Arlington, TX, USA

 

Testimony 17

The blessings of clarity and understanding you and your class inspire me to take from the word of God have impressed upon me so greatly the true, loving character of our Creator. I have found amazing freedom and joy through building a stronger, more intentional relationship with Him. What is new is that this is now a relationship built on love, reverence and respect rather than fear and obligation, and as such my eyes have been slammed OPEN as I am continually impressed by the manifestations of God’s true character in His provisions for fallen man.

T.E.H., Salt Lake City, UT, USA

 

Testimony 12

I have been really blessed reading your response to the various questions on your site.

K.C., OH, USA

 

Testimony 69

After reading your book, ‘Could It Be This Simple,’ someone was explaining Christianity in a way that made sense to me for the first time in my life. One morning, I simply prayed “I’m sorry and I love you.” As soon as I silently said that, I could literally feel God’s presence and light flood down on me from above and fill me up with love and joy. I sat there crying my eyes out, because I was so overpowered with this feeling of love and joy. It was just so incredible. I hope that more people can read this book and get a blessing from it. It’s really amazing.

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