Call Us: 423 661-4734 | Email: requests@comeandreason.com      
How Jesus Destroys the Carnal Nature

How Jesus Destroys the Carnal Nature

I received an email from a kind Christian gentleman who values the penal/legal model of salvation and questions the healing model that Come and Reason presents. I thought it might be helpful to share a portion of his email that expresses his concerns and my response:


Dr. Tim:

By your own definitions, man’s sinfulness or condition of sin is exactly man’s carnal nature, which you know well cannot be cured, healed, or restored. Our carnal nature will not be taken to heaven. It will either be replaced for believers at the Second Advent, or destroyed with its possessor in the second death. Our carnal nature will always oppose God and His will. There is no Healing Model to present as an atonement model.

As long as you tell your Sabbath School class members that Christ died for our sinfulness, they will admit that it is plausible. I challenge you to tell your class members that Christ died to heal our carnal nature and see what response you get.

Incidentally, you like to refer to another model of the atonement as “imposed law.” Is this fair? The term, “imposed law,” is not appropriate at all, because the God we worship never imposes Himself on anyone, or imposes anything on anyone.


Yes, I understand that “sinfulness” and the “carnal nature” are the same. Sinfulness is a condition that, because of Adam’s sin, we are born with and did not choose (Psalm 51:5). Thus, we are born terminal, not legally guilty. Every human being born since Adam is born with a condition that we did not choose; therefore, we individually are not in some “legal” situation of our making—we are in a sin-sick situation of our birth. This carnal condition is what causes acts of sin and results in death (James 1:15; Galatians 6:8). The acts of sin are symptoms of the condition, not the cause of the condition.

The plan of salvation is God’s intervention to eradicate the death condition and replace it with God’s eternal-life condition (Romans 6:23). This requires that God’s law (which is the law that life is built to operate upon) be written upon our hearts and minds (Hebrews 8:10). But we are unable to do this. This is what Christ came to do for us, to be the remedy to our condition, to eradicate (not merely heal) the carnal nature and replace the carnal nature with a righteous sinless nature that He, as a human, developed for us. This state of restoration to mature righteousness is known in the Bible as being perfect. Adam and Eve in Eden were sinless but not perfect. Jesus became our Savior when He destroyed the carnal nature and developed a perfect, sinless, and righteous human nature (Hebrews 5:9). Thus, Jesus heals humanity, not the carnal nature. At Gethsemane and the cross, Jesus chose righteousness, God’s law of love, and rejected selfishness and, thus, crucified the humanity that He inherited through Mary (Galatians 4:4), the part that “tempted him in every way like us” (Hebrews 4:15). But the part of His humanity that He received from the Holy Spirit was not destroyed at the cross; thus, He rose again on the third day as the same Jesus—same in character, identity, individuality, but with a purified and perfected humanity free of the carnal nature that tempts (Acts 1:11; 1 Thessalonians 4:14).

This is what He accomplished. And those who enter into a faith relationship with Jesus “die” to the old man, the carnal nature, and receive via the Holy Spirit a new heart and right spirit (Ezekiel 11:19). We receive a new nature—we become “partakers of the divine nature” (2 Peter 1:4). As Paul said, “I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me” (Galatians 2:20). As Scripture teaches, “God made him who had no sin to be sin for us, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God” (2 Corinthians 5:21).

Note, the Bible does not teach that “I have been declared to be crucified with Christ,” or “that it is declared that Christ lives in me,” or “that it is accounted that we become partakers of the divine nature,” or that “Christ became sin for us so that we could be declared the righteousness of God.” No, we actually are transformed and changed; our hearts are no longer controlled by the old carnal nature, and we get a new nature—we “become the righteousness of God!”

This is beautifully expressed in the book Christ’s Object Lessons when describing the metaphor of being clothed with the robe of Christ’s righteousness:

“By His perfect obedience He has made it possible for every human being to obey God’s commandments. When we submit ourselves to Christ, the heart is united with His heart, the will is merged in His will, the mind becomes one with His mind, the thoughts are brought into captivity to Him; we live His life. This is what it means to be clothed with the garment of His righteousness. Then as the Lord looks upon us He sees, not the fig-leaf garment, not the nakedness and deformity of sin, but His own robe of righteousness, which is perfect obedience to the law of Jehovah” (p. 311).

This is the reality—actual heart/mind transformation and renewal to love what God loves and to live in harmony with the principles of God’s kingdom.

The penal/legal view is a fraud and a lie that teaches people that they are legally declared to be righteous when they remain unrighteous. It prevents people from experiencing the true healing of heart and mind that God has provided through Christ. The legal view of salvation is part of the wine of Babylon that we are to reject and for which the three angels’ messages call people out of when it calls us back to worship God as Creator. This requires that we reject human imposed-law constructs and understand that God’s laws are the design protocols upon which reality operates and, therefore, salvation is the action of God to heal, fix, recreate, restore human beings back to righteousness, which requires restoring His living law of love within us. This is the reality: All legal/penal theologies are based on Satan’s view of God’s law and keep people trapped in a hopeless system.

Regarding “imposed law,” it is a term that differentiates the design laws upon which the Creator builds reality and life (laws of gravity and physics; laws of health; law of love, liberty, truth; the moral laws; etc.) from the arbitrary laws that sinful beings make—rules that are legislated or enacted that require external enforcement by a ruling authority. God’s government never uses imposed laws or compelling power; His laws are not like human laws. Thus, the imposed-law terminology is quite accurate, and the imposed-law idea is an infection from Satan that is at the heart of the penal/legal theologies. I urge you to reject the idea that God’s law functions like human law and to begin worshiping Him as Creator—recognizing that all His laws are design laws and that the entire penal/legal construct is a fraud.

Email me the blog whenever a new one is published.

Donate online, securely via PayPal using your credit or debit card (no PayPal account needed, unless you want to set up a monthly, recurring payment).


cancel recurring payment

 

Want to use zelle instead?
See how on our
Support and Donations page.

Upcoming Events

calendar

Testimonial Post Slider

Testimony 20

I just wanted to personally thank you for your teachings and insight into scripture. I came across your website via my cousin who suggested I look into “Healing the Mind” information. My youngest daughter has been struggling over the last couple of years and it all came to a head this spring. When I started listening to the “Healing the Mind” lectures my own life began to be transformed. I began sharing with all my daughters the concepts you laid out so clearly. I ordered your book and soaked it up. I just want to say “Thank You!” My walk with the Lord has been refreshed and renewed. Your obedience to the Lord is a blessing to so many.

R. K., Anderson, SC, USA

 

Testimony 1

Thank you! I love listening to the Come And Reason Ministries Bible study classes and am using some of your notes to get the lessons together that I will be teaching. You always have such good quotes and Bible texts and pull things together to make good sense.

T. C., IN, USA

 

Testimony 19

I truly believe that to know who God really is the first step to understand ourselves in a balanced and kind way, so the healing can take place. Your approach really makes sense – Thank you for your ministry!

A.M., Pittsburg, PA, USA

Testimony 32

The message [of Come And Reason Ministries is] for all Christians (and those who may become Christians) and not just Adventists or any other group. It is difficult to imagine why any [anyone] with intellectual and spiritual honesty could find fault with the way you explained the healing substitution concepts and the truth about God’s character, though I know some will reject and criticize. On behalf of those in our group near Tacoma, WA, thank you and your staff for all of the hard work and for sharing the Gospel in this manner. God’s message of healing love will be carried to the whole world and then Jesus will come – He promised it.

Terry U., Tacoma, WA, USA

 

Testimony 7

Ok, so last night I listened to “The Law of Liberty” and “How to Achieve Victory: Freedom, Truth and Spirtual Warfare.” These are both MY ABSOLUTE FAVORITES so far! The logic is just soooooo beautiful. I had to re-listen to them a couple of times. I just want to EXPLODE! (<< we assume with joy and happiness)

N. B., Canada

 

Testimony 51

I Love This Ministry!!!!!!! I see first hand how this message is desperately needed, how erroneous beliefs about God and His Character negatively affect humanity at every level. I thank God for your ministry, as I was searching on my own and was discovering some of your same beliefs and was blown away when I found your ministry. I know you hear it all the time, but it is truly life changing. May God continue to reveal His Will to you and Bless you!

Eric S., Sanford, FL, USA

 

Testimony 13

I borrowed “Healing The Mind” DVDs from a friend and showed them at my home for a small gathering of women friends. Neither of my friends are Adventist, but they both enjoyed and embraced the messages you taught. In fact, one of the ladies prayed out loud in our group and that was the first time she had ever had public prayer.

J.B. ,Dalles, OR, USA

 

Testimony 58

I have been watching your videos in The Power of Love seminar and I must say these have liberated me and have improved my relationship with the Lord. I am no longer terrified of him as I was before following your teachings.

Thando N., South Africa

 

Testimony 28

I have been following your Bible study class for about a year now. I must say I am impressed with how your ministry has grown. I took it upon myself to listen to all your lesson podcasts from the past and they have both enriched me physically, mentally, emotionally and spiritually. I have learnt a lot from this class. I have also noticed how the class has grown in spiritual strength. One of the things that benefited me is that now I am not afraid of God. I use to be, but now it has melted away. The second thing is that you helped me to have a real life relationship with God. Now He is my friend that was always there and I love having him with me all the time. Thirdly, because of this class, it inspired me to take over and lead a class. I have called it “Let Us Reason Together,” adapting your inquisitive style and creating a class of free thinkers.

T. Banda, Malawi, Africa

 

Testimony 42

I am just writing to say that I have been so blessed by the teachings of Come And Reason Minitries recently. I watched last week’s bible study lesson on Youtube and am thankful that the error in the printed lesson guide you use was pointed out and this week’s study was of equal benefit, if not more so. My understanding of God’s nature has been very confused of late and I am so grateful for clarity in this matter. I have never really fully understood previously how a good God can cause bad things to happen and now I realise that He doesn’t, it’s a natural consequence of sin. May the almighty Father and His Son, our Saviour Jesus Christ, continue to bless your ministry.

Laura P., United Kingdom

 

Testimony 4

I’m a youth leader in South Africa. We as a youth group are currently using a lot of the material on the Come and Reason site. Since we’ve started using the material, our youth group has grown.

R. V. N., South Africa

 

Testimony 43

Two years ago I stumbled upon your book, “Could It Be This Simple,” and then found “The God-Shaped Brain” videos on YouTube, your bible study class, and the ‘Come And Reason’ mobile app. I shared your book with a friend and after nine months of showing love, patience, and kindness this person has been changed by the love of God, too. The same love that healed me, I now express to other women in tangible ways, such as to a Baptist woman with high anxiety and childhood trauma. She was extremely happy and relieved when I shared about the so-called “judgment of God” and burning in hell. She had no desire to serve a God that was so harsh. I have repeated the phrase dozens of times to her. “What we believe has power over us, but we have power over what we believe…”

This message that you are sharing has changed my life. I will continue to serve other women and bring this message of God’s healing love to their lives by sharing your books, YouTube videos, and The Remedy Bible app. Keep up the good work. Don’t be discouraged. God is doing a mighty work in and through this ministry!

Jill L., Midwest, USA

 

Testimony 59

I’m a native Ghanan, but am currently in France for my master’s degree. Prior to this, during my final years at undergraduate studies in Ghana, I was introduced to your ministry and I’ve been immensely blessed by what you share, especially about the Design and Imposed Laws. God richly bless you for that.

One of the first things I did when I arrived in France was to buy all four of your books. They not only helped me, but those I shared them with. I shared the message with an atheist student and I marveled at how God worked mightily in his life. Today this person shares the Love of God with others and debunks theories of who God is not. I want to share what you present in your “Heavenly Sanctuary and Investigative Judgment” pamphlet, because the message brought rest to my soul and I live today as a healthy person.

God bless you so much and your ministry.

Michael A., Ghana

 

Testimony 54

I had a lot of pressure, as a pastor’s kid, to conform and be “good.” I was good at being “good.” I thought my life was going along well until it all started falling apart and I could not figure out why! In my search for “why is this happening to me, God?” I came across your book, “Could it be this Simple,” and God started revealing to me the many distortions I held about His character, His principles, and how He has designed His universe to operate. I remember thinking, “Wow, I have had this all backwards.” I was happy and angry all at the same time. Happy to have the light of truth break through the darkness, revealing a wonderful, beautiful way of understanding God and His plan for His children, and angry, because I felt deceived and cheated by the church, my family, and myself!

My heart thrills when I listen to your bible study lessons. Literally I have gone from death to life. It is a journey I look forward to every day, as God reveals areas this distortion affects. Praise GOD! I will ever be grateful to God for this ministry and your cooperation with the Spirit!

Karen S., Portal, AZ, USA

 

Testimony 27

Your teachings about our heavenly Father have changed my life. Thank you sooooooo very very much! I know He’s doing some serious healing in my heart and life and I look forward to each new day to learn something new about Him and to just hear you speak about Him. Thank you, forever.

Nancy S.